Last edited: Thursday, May 04, 2006 at 9:42:31 AM

It IS hammer time!!! HAM-MER! HAM-MER!

Is someone looking for me?

Time to hammer up a new chart aye!

Since it appears that it's not going to be addressed I'm going to make this known so there's no surprises. If you're hosting and playing on the same machine and it causes horrific lag, as it did for 7 players in our last game, you probably won't have a game against the Eds at all.

Let one of your other 5 or 6 dudes take your spot. Or, simply switch weeks with them and have the courtesy to let the other 7 folks have a decent game with normal lag. Heck, If you don't have 4 people I'll leave also so a 3 on 3 can be played.

I'd rather not waste my team's time with what should have been an easily resolved situation.

Word.

P.S. To stir the pot. I really think the situation we encountered is planned since HBM did have five players show. The host could have sat.

Last edited: Friday, March 03, 2006 at 5:23:44 PM

^Spoon man! I never heard of these "hosters cant play" rule and I've been in the league for quite some time. Lag will happen. Problem is the Ed's have been playing on the Eastern servers and are not used to playing on a West coast server. Part of the game for now, and has been for quite a while.

KKB, we play on a West Coast server quite a bit. Baba hosts our matches as does Nutso. Please read, or read again, the posts by all. You don't honestly think I don't know there's lag in TT? That said, there's a difference between having lag and having lag from a player who's hosting and also playing on the same machine. It killed your team also, so only one player had an enjoyable experience that night. Yet we were told to "stop whining and play." This is unfortunate since most of the lag for all of us could have been prevented.

This is supposed to be fun, right?

I have been hosting and playing on the same machine for almost 3 years. Rogue's unpleasant experience was not a direct result of me playing and hosting. It was just a bad confluence of connections. It is not so "easily resolved" as there are lots of variables. It was not a planned tactic as Rogue suggests. We don't happen to have anyone else on our team that can host.

If you can find anyone that believes hosting and playing on the same machine doesn't lag out the rest of us I'm wiling to listen.

Until then I'll take BC's word for it

I host on a G5 dual 1.8 GHz.

I can see this is going to be a back and forth forever. RX, buddy, when people are playing on your server and you join you've never noticed the, "Man it got laggy in here.'?

I guess my point will never be made. Regardless, when playing the Eds on your home map please do us a favor and sit if you're hosting. I will too if it makes things happy for all. If the lag doesn't improve call me red faced.

Everyone knows X blows on servers other than his own :)

What was the question?

Good topic and, as much as it pains me, I'd have to back Rogue up on this. Long gone are the days when hosting on your crap box made you a worse player vs the rest. Seems simple enough.

In all honesty, I hosted our first league game and played on the same machine. It wans't a great experience. I had worse "in-game" performance in that game than I do in almost any other decent server. And I had virtually no ping at all. After that game I asked dash if he could host for several reasons. The first of course is my own selfishness, I wanted better performance, I felt real "nerffy" ans "soft" playing on the same sevrer I was hosting on. The second was I wanted the games to be better for all. I think we can agree Dash has a great performing set up and our games would be better suited, hosted on his server. Either way people still bitch about my low ping, but I didn't move here because of Dash.
As a matter of fact I get a better ping in Dash's server than Dash does. Go figure.

I love Rx's box. XD

Take that, however you choose. Hehe

Do any other teams host/play on the same computer? I personally would hate to see that become the trend.

As I have tried to point out before this is not a matter of playing on a west coast server. Just before the game we practiced on baba's server and had no issues. Not sure if he was hosting and playing on same computer, but had no issues. There is a huge difference between just ping lag and server lag. I have played this game a few times and know how to host, I have seen what server lag is and how it affects the players. Players that have the higher ping the vast majority of time affected greater by the server lag than others since the cpu is already having a hard time dealing.

I play on a dual Pent. 4 3.4 Ghz HT extreme computer running linux. Not to many computers can touch that and serving/playing puts a stress on that. Thats why I have different computer that I built (geek hobby) as my server, the Frankendell (not to many dell parts anymore.) I have played on many a west coast server, including Rx's and nothing has been that bad. I think when we first got there we were ok because Rx was not doing to much driving but talking with his team, but as the game started.....well we know. As many of us know that hosting a server is not a hard thing to do, we are all capable. If one of your team is sitting have them host. Heck go buy an old crappy computer and use that to host. Heck I was able to host games on an old Pent II sony Viao laptop that my dad was going to let go, well till the hard drive went. Heck I know a few people who would be happy to help set linux up on it. Not to mention there a few other people who would propbaly be happy to host for anyone.

I look forward to Wednesday nights game. Always intense, always fun I would hate to have them ruined.

That accusation seems unwarranted to me, but I understand the Eds' frustration. I too have been in league games that I would rather have forfeited. In general, and if possible, its best to host and play on separate machines.

Because league games can be some very high quality fun, I'm willing to pay for it if necessary. What kind of pings do y'all get to this IP address? 208.160.156.30 I get 70-80ms routing via IA > Chicago > Denver (use traceroute). We could get a colo server there for $30/month.

I wonder if some kind of East/West conference scheme on data center Denver/Chicago servers would improve the fun? We are working with physical limitations due to distance that cannot be overcome.

Yes lets keep the accusations alone, for now anyway. How does one get a rule added? What is the procedure, do I make a case for the captains to the commish or to the community? Obviously I would like a vote of no confidence , wait thats star wars, I mean a vote on server/hosting. I would really hate to see that become the norm.

@BC
nuts@nuts:~$ ping 208.160.156.30
PING 208.160.156.30 (208.160.156.30) 56(84) bytes of data.
From 208.172.164.102 icmp_seq=4 Packet filtered
From 208.172.164.102 icmp_seq=5 Packet filtered
From 208.172.164.102 icmp_seq=6 Packet filtered
From 208.172.164.102 icmp_seq=7 Packet filtered
From 208.172.164.102 icmp_seq=8 Packet filtered
From 208.172.164.102 icmp_seq=9 Packet filtered
From 208.172.164.102 icmp_seq=11 Packet filtered
From 208.172.164.102 icmp_seq=12 Packet filtered
From 208.172.164.102 icmp_seq=13 Packet filtered

--- 208.160.156.30 ping statistics ---
13 packets transmitted, 0 received, +9 errors, 100% packet loss, time 1

That the right address? Well, whatever, if your pinging 70 to 80 I'll be the same if not lower XD. Count me in.

You have to use traceroute to get a ping for the sentry router.

Last edited: Saturday, March 04, 2006 at 7:08:59 AM

Heh. BC, I wanted a friggin response and for some reason "stirring the pot" works best here on PTT. XD

On the bright side, it seems to have worked finally.

Nuts, if you want a response you gotta stir that pot.^{Hint, try mother jokes.}

Last edited: Saturday, March 04, 2006 at 7:39:03 AM

@BC
Ahhh 67 to 70 to denver

@ROGUE
Stir with my stir stick or dipstick?

On second thought, I've got the perfect way for you to accomplish your goal Nutso. See CADC's post in the General Forum. "Lewis is Back," is the title I do believe. Whoever Lewis is? But anyway, make a recording and post it here. For amplification I suggest you play the part of Lewis in your recording. XD

God, it's serious in here, I can't breath... My league days are numbered - humor has taken a dive off the cliff, bringing the scrum with him!

In another news I now have the captainship of the Hamsters. ^{I get that sinking feeling}

@Rogue:

Aren't you the same guy who just last week insisted on playing 4 on 3 against CTB??

Maybe that was a result of you joining the server!

Totally uncalled for accusation.

I have spent a lot of time effort and energy trying to make this a fun and fair place to play. I have contributed a lot to this game and will continue to do so. I really welcome and don't mind suggestions on how to make this better. Just try and be a bit more considerate and constructive. I do not appreciate your attitude. If you want to get things changed, why not just make a formal proposal?

@Nuts!: The procedure to change the rules is that a Captain can make a proposal and then all the Captains can vote on it. Ask your captain to make a proposal and it will be circulated for discussion amongst the Captains. I have no problem with that at all.

reactive and unnecessary comment edited out.

The rules were written by consensus over many seasons and are not some arbitrary autocratic way to stack the season to my own personal advantage. This rule in particular came into being when we migrated over to playing on Mods, and in particular mods that use expansion pack elements. It has completely solved the problem of not having a server to play on. If you recall, that did in fact used to be a problem. Sure it is "easy" to host, but in actual fact not that many of us are set up to do it, and with the expansion pack it is something that takes significant time to set up and get going. The rule came from people wanting there to be a minimum of restrictions on possible servers, and yet evening out any advantage/disadvantage by having equal numbers of home and away games. I do think it has helpled games to start on time and with a minimum of hassle . That is a bit of background on this. However, if there is an improvement to be made, then lets do it.

Last edited: Saturday, March 04, 2006 at 10:11:02 AM

Yes I am RX. Please read my posts during the past two seasons in which I asked that all captains try and play a three on three to keep it fun. I was the one who suggested this, remember? My favors were not returned and my post was ignored. My team asked that I do not allow this to happen again.

So, again, please don't host and play while playing the Eds. If you do, there won't be a game. No proposal is needed when the solution is obvious. I'll go by the advice and circumstances made available by other server hosts.

If you mean by being more considerate and constructive it would involve unresponsiveness or replies such as, "stop whining and play," to members of my team, I can do that.

We wouldn't even be talking about this if you would have allowed us to quickly resolve the situation.

Hey, ya, we could do that over if you feel bad about that. :)

Please lets keep on topic.

@ROGUE
Please send an email to all captains, thanks.

@BC
We waited over 15 minutes to let someone show up. Who should we have sat, not fair to those that show. True wasn't a fun game game but I gota hand it to those guys they never gave up.

@Rx
I never meant anything personal by any of this. You have done a fantastic job for the scrum league and the community. I liked meeting you in Chicago and Bming the heck out of ya.

I don't know why anyone would willing want to play a game that few could enjoy? Isn't that why voice was taken away due to the lag it caused?

Last edited: Saturday, March 04, 2006 at 10:46:46 AM

@ Nuts, hey man thanks for the praise, T-34, Knuckler and I tried our best vs 4 of you. I often tell others (more new players), buck up, focus, think and try; the worst that can happen is that you will learn and get better. We did thanks again!

Other topic I feel the love here man, I love this game and all you goof balls. Also where is the spamming freak ACA ? XD

Ok - point retracted. I will edit my post.

I do encourage open discussion. I think that is the best for the league. I also think we should try and work together to make the rules and guidelines the best for the long term, so that we are all happy to follow them.

Sorry to anyone I offended.

Yes, that was an unfortunate situation for everybody that showed. I'm also disappointed that I wasn't able to give advance notice to everybody that we would be able to field only 3. My apologies to the Eds for that.

Going to fixed PSL servers in data centers would make the current discussion a non issue and would also allow captains to predict each player's connection quality when choosing teams. I think it would lead to a more satisfying experience all around.

Last edited: Saturday, March 04, 2006 at 10:36:24 AM

And the Deeks won't play if there's brown M&M's in the hospitality suite ! Well that worked for Van Halen :)

We can't have rules that only pertain to some. Rogue did you mean hosting AND playing on the same machine? If that's doable I'm not opposed to it. But If we do implement a rule mid-season, it has to remain fair for all in light of the hosting rules that we played under for the first half. Prey always plays on a different machine when we host, so it's fine with us I'd think.

For what it's worth, on a dual processor Mac (1.25) my cpu usage is much less than what's been posted.

This is what it looks like hosting & playing on a full server.

I hate the blue M&M's.
I appreciate the focus on solutions, rather than lobbing missles.

Chart check.

Looks like the bugs should have 18 not 23.

Last edited: Sunday, March 05, 2006 at 3:04:42 AM

^ Must be a LOC.

23 is OK with us :)

Also, last game was 3-on-3 so I don't know if we get 5.

But 23 is OK.

Last edited: Sunday, March 05, 2006 at 10:32:00 AM

I think I double billed em.

^ & ^^ I bet. Hehe

HAM-MER!, HAM-MER!

Did I miss the fight?

I think bugs are at 17 since the last match only got us 4 pts... No bonus : (

@Deta - I haint no spammer. I've been touched by the hammer and am now reformed. I wouldn't dare do such a a thing.

HAM-MER!, HAM-MER!

So you admit to being a freak, right. And we all know freaks need to be heard all the time.... Hence you are a.............! All with love, we need some different folk here.

Please all notice Seeds moving forward always closer to the top!

Shhhhh Delta. The plan is to sneak up on them from behind.

I greatly disapprove of the level of antagonism in here.

Beware!
the rooster is back with a plan
heheh see - if I get you all to eat too much bbq chicken then you all
will be bloated and slow...

A conflicted Tally? The hammer feels good in hand, does it not? Ohhh, it does.... Oh so many questions nagging the Ho's brain -

"Should I strike them down... Or restrain my natural impulses in the name of law and order?"

Such a noble struggle... The Ho, conflicted over the idea of whether or not to wield the power of his birthright, which is the Hammer. The power of the hammer unleashed is such a glorious thing to behold...yet, in order to maintain the balance of a fragile PSL X league, he must sheath his power and stand obiediently aside, in humble servitude to the League...

I can see your hammer finger twitching Ho.... Don't resist... Use it... USE IT MAN!!

HAM-MER! HAM-MER!

@ Seeds - there will be no sneaking to the top. Your only purpose is to take out Locos when the time comes. Bugs are on the rise. You can bet on it.

Last edited: Monday, March 06, 2006 at 1:21:59 PM

Good one Ass! Time will tell. ;)

:)

It's the midway point of the season and I'd like to drop all of you a personal note.

I hate each and everyone one of you with the passion of a starving dung beetle to newly fallen pachyderm poo. May God, Buddha, Allah, Incubus or whomever else you heathens idolize have mercy on your souls.

SPAM MER SPAM MER

Yeah tally's been after my hammer for some time now, I can tell.

Guess which finger I'm wagging? XD

*ducks, sneaks out of back of room*

You know what is fun , it was already signed :)

Nice hat Rx. :P

The world would be a better place if everyone would STHU and do as I told them to. Join me in my utopian vision and we'll change the world.
Whose in ?

Umm... What version of the utopian vision?

I'm partial to the one with the 25 year old version of Raquel Welsh.