I was playing scrum on 2 different occasions last night and both times I was repeatedly blasted when I was nowhere near the goal or scrum. Could someone please post a thread containing the rules of when it is ok to shoot someone and when it is not. There seems to be a lot of bmers all of a sudden.

No fear here. If you dont want to shoot in scrum, make a mod where you cant. Until then SHUSH.

Sometimes you feel like a nut, sometimes you don't.

@Professor

Is that anyway to talk to Mary-Ann... I don't think you are ever getting off the island... ;)

Hey Fatchick, getting softened-up is one thing, but getting completely elimated after spawning across the board is another thing. You bm'ers know exactly what I'm referring to.

@ doc - You should be a politician. Twist the question into "your" answers so that everybody momentarily forgets the question.

The reason I told you to shut about the team scrum bit is because you make your arguments on things unrelated to the question and I found that to be irritating.
What you're arguing is like saying. Its ok to walk up to someone on the street and kill them. I do it all the time especially when Im on the battlefield. Right, it is an illogical statement. That's my point. And don't respond with something about real life rules or I will loose it completely.

Arguments that doc may not use anymore in this thread.

1. It's ok to bm in team scrum.
2. Lighting up an opponent going after the scrum is a tactic.

We all know these things are ok and already agree. This is not what anybody has ever questioned, ever.

It seems to be your goal to frustrate everybody with your illogical confounded arguments which send us into circles.

You make statements that people will naturally disagree with, then rationalize it with arguments the contradict your original argument that we can't disagree with.

You are simply argumentative and all you want is a never ending argument that ends each chapter with you having the last word.

___________________________________________________________________________________

All that Sherminator wants to know is what are the "rules (of etiquette) of when it is ok to shoot someone and when it is not"

Answer: In Independent Scrum it is considered acceptable etiquette to shoot someone if they are carrying the scrum, going after the scrum or camping*. It is considered bad etiquette or bad sportsmanship to shoot at someone sitting idle(typing message) or driving, nowhere near the vicinity of either the goal or scrum.
*camping is considered bad etiquette or bad sportsmanship

I deem this to be a general consensus. If you disagree then you disagree with the majority.

MAX

Last edited: Saturday, February 19, 2005 at 2:05:39 PM

Nice answer Max. Something that might also be pointed out is that it is rarely in someone's best interests to simply shoot everyone on the field. It leads to fresh spawns, sometimes in better positions than the tank was in originally, and more often than not sends the person you kill on a pissed off killing spree of you.

On the other hand, I always fire at least a clip at any opposing tank that chooses to just toodle along in front of me, regardless of where they are. Waaay too tempting.

BM during scrum is fine, quit crying. Diving for position during scrum is suck ass and ruins game intregity. Admit it.

I love bm in scrum

Phoenix

Go ahead and BM me.....ill just dive.....

Keep doing it and I will get ahead, and then stall the rest of the game

If im too far behind I might just count how many times I can make you press the spacebar

BRING IT

B

Of course you would dive. Shows your character.

@MAX.

You, not me missed the point... The quote YOU used "containing the rules of when it is ok to shoot someone ".. It seems you, not me added "rules (of etiquette) of when it is ok to shoot someone and when it is not".. You added the word etiquette on your own. This is NOT the original question.... I tend to stick to the topic.. I repeat "it is NOT illegal to BM in srum" end of story.. Period.. The bots do it all the time.. So even the programmers agreed it is Ok.. It is a valid strategy.. Just one you don't like..

As for using shut up.. There is no excuse.. See I can respond to you in a civial manner.. I don't need to lower myself to swearing or telling you to shut up. I like the fact you have a difference of opinion.. Its what makes this forum so interesting.

The weekness in your position is that it makes the srum game only available to light tanks.. A heavy tank has to use the advantages it posses to win.. Mainly good armour.. Good gun.. Camping is a very valid way for a heavy to compete as is shooting you to soften you up.. So when you do arrive at the goal it is easy for me to finish you off.. I guess your next argument will be that heavies have no place in srum.. Now who is being silly.. It is a game for all.. Each using their tanks unique characteristics to win..

Good point, Doc!

I agree that those choosing heavies need to make the best of the characteristics of their tanks. Camping and sniping are good strategies for heavies. However, the annoying twits whose only goal is to ruin gameplay don't choose heavies.

The goal should be good game play. You describe a valid use of the heavy tank. It may bug some people, but they can do their best to counterract your strategy. It's part of the game.

I have yet to see someone try to mess up a game in a heavy. It seems to be the exclusive role of twits driving lights, and takes advantage of the speed and manueverability in much the way you describe camping and sniping fit heavies.

Gee... Am I making an argument that heavies occupy the "higher moral ground"? ;)

Last edited: Monday, February 21, 2005 at 10:15:25 AM

Actually, the bots NEVER intentionally shoot other players. They are shooting at the scrum flag on the assumption that they will hit other tanks going there. If you happen to be between them and the flag, well, you get shot.

Bot Scrum Shooting Rules:
- No one has the flag: shoot toward the flag
- Someone has the flag: shoot at that tank

Bot Team Scrum Shooting Rules:
- No one has the flag: shoot toward the flag
- Their team has the flag: shoot the nearest tank on the other team
- The other team has the flag: shoot the flag carrier

IMO, it is valid to shoot other tanks in Indy Scrum in 3 situations:
- they are near the flag
- they are near the goal
- they are BattleModing another tank

Merely "heading toward the flag" is not sufficient. If I'm on the other side of the map, OF COURSE I'm "heading toward the flag"!!! XO But that doesn't mean I consider myself to be a valid target. That just means I'm actually trying to play the game !! Surprise!!

I have no problem with heavies camping in Scrum. Never have had a problem with that. I've even mostly gotten over my annoyance at light campers. If I don't think I can get past a camper, I don't bring them the flag. If they want it, they can come and get it. ;)

The ones who annoy me are the Battlemoders (who I usually wind up battlemoding back) and the Spoilers (who I usually wind up hunting down and repeatedly killing until they get sick of it and leave) like Tanty and his ilk.

@TMO

I totally agree. I wonder if we should start declaring hunting seasons (Hey everybody! It's Tanty season!)

The crowd cheers, a chant goes up (a hunting we will go, a hunting we will go...) and after being repeatedly surrounded and roasted, the BMers leave... XD

Last edited: Monday, February 21, 2005 at 10:34:58 AM

@ doc - actually the title of the thread is "Scrum rules of etiquette"

Therefore the subject is "rules of etiquette" and when he uses "rules" later in the paragraph it is clear that "rules of etiquette" is still the subject.

Also his question was not about the validity of heavies in scrum. You did that. You made it about you. It's not about you. It's about being "repeatedly blasted when... Nowhere near the goal or scrum"

Arguments that doc may not use anymore in this thread. (Revised)

1. It's ok to bm in team scrum.
2. Lighting up an opponent going after the scrum is a tactic
3. Heavies in scrum.

Where I come from "shut up" is not swearing. But, ok then. I guess I'm a sinful heathen.
Would you prefer "please refrain from that subject of discourse since it is completely irrelevant to the present discussion".

Does my declaration of a general consensus make the "scrum game only available to light tanks"?
Oh, I suppose on that extremely rare occasion when a heavy is actually playing the game, they will head for the goal no the scrum.
Fine. I revised the bit about camping.

Answer: In Independent Scrum it is considered acceptable etiquette to shoot someone if they are carrying the scrum, going after the scrum or camping*. It is considered bad etiquette or bad sportsmanship to shoot at someone sitting idle(typing message) or driving, nowhere near the vicinity of either the goal or scrum.
*camping in light is considered bad etiquette or bad sportsmanship

(special note)
For the record I thought I would include my personal opinion, since everything else was just observation.
I think playing scrum in a heavy is like using wrong tool for the job.
It's so much more fun in light tanks and so frustrating in heavy. I figured that's why nobody else really used heavies for real scrum games

When I have played with folks in heavies, it seemed they were just there to disrupt the game. Since they did all the things that make the game not fun.
ie. Camp, BM, and dive with the scrum.
Maybe I just played with Bertha too much.

MAX

<div class="quoteblock"></div>

Answer: In Independent Scrum it is considered acceptable etiquette to shoot someone if they are carrying the scrum, going after the scrum or camping*. It is considered bad etiquette or bad sportsmanship to shoot at someone sitting idle(typing message) or driving, nowhere near the vicinity of either the goal or scrum.

This is the answer I was looking for, thanks Max

Most of the good players I lose against (notice I said "lose"), play by these rules. They are very good players and don't need to resort to bm'ing in order to win. I enjoy losing to these guys because even though I am not winning, I am learning how to become better at my game. I enjoy playing with Tally, The Professor, Chong, Paisano, etc because they play fair!
( I just wish The Professor would give me a lesson in targeting...damn he's a good shot!)

Last edited: Monday, February 21, 2005 at 2:28:29 PM

Lead your target. Don't shoot where he is, shoot where he's going to be when your shots get there.

That's usually what I try to do, but I have so much lag on this end (maybe you do also) that the shots don't fire until a second or 2 after I hit the mouse button. Sometimes though, it fires right away. Is this a common problem with TT?

@ Sherm

You need a clean boot before you fire up TT. Also - don't forget your vitamins.

@MAX,

It seems we can agree on one thing we will never agree. Lol.. I am not the only one who disagrees with your rules...If you follow the whole thread you will find a number of people who agree with my position.. So maybe I speak for the others.. I have played scrum the odd time in a heavy ( the only tank I usually play in ) I camp and I BM people.. BUT not to annoy and not to spoil the game but to try and win!. I rarely kill someone on purpose but I like leaving them smoking so I know when they do achieve the flag they will be much easier to kill.. I do NOT think this is bad sportsmanship or against the rules. I think we have already established it is not against the rules.

I have been competitive in most of the scrum games I have played with this strategy. I can't tell you if they were top notch players or not since it is not a forum I usually enjoy. However I do not like being told it is against the rules when it clearly is not. As for shut up yes, we obviously come from different sides of the track. Lol.. Just different upbringings I suppose. I think it would make a great thread though. (If telling someone to shut up is considered rude. I think you would find almost all people agree it is).

I also want to thank you for telling me what arguments I can and can not use.. I love a debater trying to control the discussion so it favors them.. Good job.. And good luck.. Lol.. I am a person who speaks his mind and will always be respectful of others positions even if I do not agree with them.. That is the purpose of these forums isn’t it?

Sigh.

@doc -
You talk about rules that we know don't exist, we talk about etiquette.

What are you trying so hard to rationalize.
Fine, you like to play scrum as a heavy.
Fine, lighting up an opponent going after the scrum is a tactic.
Fine, It's ok to bm in team scrum.
Nobody ever disagreed with this.

I have been objective and reasonable with you.
I'm done trying to get you to follow the discussion.
You want desperately that this be about you, and it's not.
For the last time it's about being "repeatedly blasted when... Nowhere near the goal or scrum"

I answered Sherminator's question as best I could based on the thousands of hours I've played this game and what I felt was most reasonable general consensus.

END

You are forgiven my son.

^ From the Rev himself

Inmates are running the asylum.

Where's stinky?
Where's TG?
Where's anything other than the goofy posts out there?

STOP THE MADNESS!