Forums Index >> General >> Something the Democrats and Republicans agree on.
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Proof?
Proof of what?
Jimmy Hoffa B)
That your mom and dad weren't really related. XD
Like a midget at a urinal, I was going to have to be on my toes.
Invite a retard to a picnic and you'd better expect to get drool in the potato salad.
Along the lines of proof:
http://thinkprogress.org/2006/02/17/ports-uae/
The UAE was one of three countries in the world to recognize the Taliban as the legitimate government of Afghanistan.
The UAE has been a key transfer point for illegal shipments of nuclear components to Iran, North Korea and Lybia.
According to the FBI, money was transferred to the 9/11 hijackers through the UAE banking system.
After 9/11, the Treasury Department reported that the UAE was not cooperating in efforts to track down Osama Bin Laden�s bank accounts.
http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/politics/13915993.htm
One more wonderful moment brought to you by Bu$h co. Having fun yet?
Last edited: Monday, February 20, 2006 at 9:12:10 PM
Thanks Stink! I heard about this on the way home from work today listening to who else but Mike Savage. I cannot believe what Bush is thinking on this one. Must be love of money. I dunno. KKB
Obvious attempt to destabilize the united states /
other explanations /
not forthcoming /
Lackluster attempt at cultural sensitivity?
Perhaps there is some agreement here also. Are these people making America more secure??
From AMERICAblog
This is an amazing story but considering everything that we have witnessed from the Bush team over the last few years, it is hardly surprising. Where did these people get the idea that policing porn somehow fit into the Homeland Security agenda of protecting America from terrorism? Sorry, but I'm not buying the story that they were enforcing a local sexual harassment policy. These people were surely trained to do a job so how did this find it's way into their daily routine? Who is giving these people their orders?
Two uniformed men strolled into the main room of the Little Falls library in Bethesda one day last week and demanded the attention of all patrons using the computers. Then they made their announcement: The viewing of Internet pornography was forbidden.
The men looked stern and wore baseball caps emblazoned with the words "Homeland Security." The bizarre scene unfolded Feb. 9, leaving some residents confused and forcing county officials to explain how employees assigned to protect county buildings against terrorists came to see it as their job to police the viewing of pornography.
My only question is "how far down do you pull a baseball cap before it becomes a Brown Shirt "?
...granpa sluggy who lived in Franco's Spain in the '50s....................................................................................
Last edited: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 at 12:22:19 AM
^ So you haven't signed a loyalty oath to Bush yet? Just like Santa they seem to be making a list...
{WalMart free for over 24 months!}
^^How far indeed...
Same goes with the so-called war on drugs which is cover for a war on the poor, inner city youth and people of color. It's amazing how fast you can turn a democracy into a fascist state. Take one tablespoon fear, a pinch of isolationism, 2 cups never-ending war, 1/2 cups religious fanaticism...
Stir the pot with the whisk of patriotism, bake in the GOP oven...
Pug
I don't understand. You're telling me UAE will now control US ports security? Or Iraqis ports? :o
The UAE is buying US ports on the East Coast from the British.
Shucks I made it onto their list way back in the Seventies.
...granpa sluggy
I get it... Did some research. An UAE-based business is buying those ports from a British business. I guess that's what free trade, open market and globalization means. Ok the UAE as a country does not have an impeccable record, but which government or country does? Pre-Chinese Tibet or Bhutan come to mind...
This is an interesting reaction you guys are having... I.e. It's ok for 'westerners' and specifically the US to have strategic interests and investments everywhere in the world, in literally every country on this planet (except perhaps Cuba, Iran and North Korea and a few more - even then, who knows?) but it's NOT ok to have some countries buying strategic interest in US in the name of security...
Meanwhile your military forces have built a huge base in Dubai, and Dubai is also a naval base for your navy. Even puny Canada have built a Permanent Military Base south of Dubai! (which frankly is ridiculous).
Yesterday I was reading in the paper that in Nigeria, Shell actually gives access to their facilities airstrips to government military forces battling (a perhaps legitimate) popular rebellion... Etc.
What I'm saying is this: double standard. It's ok to have your military forces in their capital, but it's not ok for a company to invest in the 'homeland'. US have the right (if not the duty) to trespass anywhere in the world for their own security, while nations that are portrayed as evil and potentially a base for terrorists should be shut down from investing in some sector of your economy.
This said I'm sure most of you will say 'why the hell are we having a base in Dubai'? Good question. Plus this mega-base currently being built in Iraq - it's will purportedly be the largest US base outside of the US... Talk about pulling out! Sorry but your military folks are a bit... Hmm... Out of control maybe?
Here's what I found too:
http://archives.cnn.com/2001/US/09/21/gen.america.under.attack/
UAE withdraws recognition of the Taliban September 22, 2001
and
http://www.nola.com/newsflash/business/index.ssf?/base/business-57/1139669668214270.xml&storylist=business
lots said there on this file, including different point of views.
Ok Brain's went all 'devil's advocate'... There are 100 loopholes in what I wrote above, but then it's written on the lam. I'm (obviously) not a scholar, just a citizen.
-----------
I think the solution is indeed through integration, liberal and open market, and cross-investment. This is what guarantees peace - the relatively free flow of goods and people. 'National' economies partly led to WW1, while I read somewhere that 'nation that trade don't fight'. But of course one current worrisome trend is 'religion-based decision making in geo-politics', and I think this is what worries us all most, in our lovely and peaceful North American secular society. Let's hope they will be good capitalists.
Brain, are you tring to rain on the xenophobic parade?
I made a mistake at top post. Port security will still be run by the coast guard and homeland security. I was listening to Fox news on the way to work and they said this whole thing about the ports is blown out of proportion. I beg to differ with that opinion even with our Coast Guard and Homeland security there.
Over the past five years I've done business with more than a dozen Arabic men, women and families. Eighteen to be exact. Call me what you will but in terms of business I don't trust those folks as far as I can throw Hugo. Think I'm being an idiot? You've never done business with an Arab then. It's an entirely different experience. If you think we're big bullies here in the US when it comes to business you don't know a friggin thing.
Here's the business philosophy from all 18 accounts: Screw you. I want you to pay more than anyone else and you're friggin nuts if you think I'm gonna pay for dookie. More clearly, I want you to pay through the nose and I don't want to give up a dime. Me, me, me. This is the understatement of the year for me as well.
Short, sweet and to the point. Still think I'm an idiot? We in the US bitch about the disappearing middle class. Take a look at any Arabic country and find me any semblance of there every being a middle class.
Letting the UAE take control of a few of our ports or any business is ludicrous.
CNN and other news orgs have been asking all day if there's an Arabic bias going on. Yes! Rightly so IMHO. Remember Wolf and the rest of you idiot media folk? The friggin little planes in the air? The friggin flag burning and death to America parades that have gone on far longer than anything the dimwit Bush has done?
I've some fine Arabic friends here in D.C. Ask any of yours who've been in the States or Canada for a while if they'd do business with another Arab. They'll tell you no friggin way. I guarantee it. All of the foks I know have.
P.S. I get so sick of America bashing at times. Yah, we do a lot of stupid stuff. Take a look at your Arab buddies. Anyone that reads this. Take a look at their track record on something as simple as human rights. The "your army" BS chaps my ass too. Put a powerful army in an Arabic countries hands and see WTF happens. All I know is that if it ever happens those virgins they're promising better be hot.
WOW! The ramblings of a Far Left Democrat too.
My venting was aimed at nobody. Just my non-perfect view of international relations. Everybody and every country, whether you admit it or not, is out to screw you in one way or another. If you don't believe that, find the tallest bridge in your area and dive for the coins at the bottom of the river.
To put a wrap on my rambling rant: There's the way the world should be, and the way I wish it could be, and then there's the sledghammer in the crotch that is reality. Trust nobody and you'll be better off.
Like a midget at a urinal, I was going to have to be on my toes.
Invite a retard to a picnic and you'd better expect to get drool in the potato salad.
Last edited: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 at 5:16:17 PM
Brain, are you tring to rain on the xenophobic parade?
hmm I don't understand.
You've never done business with an Arab then. It's an entirely different experience
I've been in retail for 12 years, and my relationship with customers have not been corporate, but mostly with individuals on holidays or on business travels, so I have a limited experience, but then we all do. However I think high capital business generally is cut-throat, regardless of nationality.
Every nationality is indeed different: I generally find that Americans are the most generous and Asians are the cheapest, the latter because they have access to so much commodities at ridiculous prices. Arabic people are interesting to deal with: they'll often try to get a ridiculous price and walk away if refused, but if you stand your ground and chat some more they become very warm and generous. They're definitely testing you when they conduct transactions, but then their bartering trades are famous. They've been on the major trade routes for eons and this sharpness is in their DNA I guess lol! They are very cutting indeed. European are accommodating and courteous.
In the past 5 years I've seen 2 interesting trends: the rise of South American and Chinese tourism due to the slow emergence of a middle-class there.
Letting the UAE take control of a few of our ports or any business is ludicrous
hmm those are business interests, not another nation-state, thus I give them the benefit of the doubt. This is a bit what I was referring to. But then I know you have good reason to be paranoid in reference to planting a nuke in a container, etc. However I don't think the nationality of the ownership matters THAT much.
Here in Canada there's always people saying the Americans are buying everything. Case in point, the recent purchase of HBC (Hudson's Bay Company) by an 'american'. This company is very iconic in Canada, for it is tied to our history. BUT frankly I think at our level (re. Middle-class) it matters little if the 'owners' of a corporation are from Dubai, London, Toronto, New York or Mumbay.
Capitalism is transnational, it answers to its own rules. It's a nasty environment, and you can quickly sink a big ship if you don't navigate it properly. Corporations wants to maximize profit for their shareholders, that's the bottom line. They want deals from the government, and want to pay their employees the cheapest possible wage. Major North AMerican corporations cannot afford their pension plans anymore against global competition. It does not always look good ahead.
[quote[P.S. I get so sick of America bashing at times.[/quote]
Yes I can understand that lol! But then since WW2 the US is the mightiestplayer on this planet, so I guess it comes with the territory! Anyone at the top will get the most flak. Don't take it personally, man. Everyone loves America and Americans, but not everyone can agree on your country's foreign policy - especially when you're on the receiving end of the 'big stick'. US Foreign Policy is the craziest thing around nowadays, and that's what your government must come to understand.
IMO those doing wholesale condemnation of America and 'hating' America and burning flags are the laughing stock of the world, and a bunch of dinosaurs. The world is moving forward and these zombies will eventually wake up or be further relegated to the dustbin of history.
The "your army" BS chaps my ass too.
In case you've been living in a cave for the past century, there a difference between America between great and safe and powerful, and between America being an 'HyperPower' with military bases in every corner of the world, whether the locals like it or not. Your country had to thread a fine balance between isolationism and interventionism, and it seems that since WW2 the latter is in fashion.
[quote]Put a powerful army in an Arabic countries hands and see WTF happens
They'd most likely use it lol! Isn't what weapons are made for?
WOW! The ramblings of a Far Left Democrat too.
hmm dunno if this was addressed to me, but, er.. All I can say is that I dismissed the antiquated 'left-right' definition long ago. It's so... Primitive, and doesn't help AT ALL. No offense but I think it's a grotesque simplification.
If anything I'd define myself as a Cosmopolitan
.
Everybody and every country, whether you admit it or not, is out to screw you in one way or another.
Yes I agree to a degree, however there are 'alliances' easing up relationships. Western Europe and Noth America is pretty open and I like to think the players can accept win-win compromises. Until recently South America got a bad treatment but that's changing. Africa still mostly gets it the hard way. One of the sourest point for these 2 regions is the agricultural subsidies of Europe and N. America which effectively close the market for their product. This is what's been stalling the latest rounds of economic multilateral talks of the WTO.
Traditionally Asia had hard to access markets (Japan and China comes to mind) and unfortunately the US has a huge trade deficit with China, which won't allow its yuan to be 'free floating'.
The US-Canada commercial relationship is a good one that for sure, the only outstanding sour note from our side is the Lumber Agreement, which even though NAFTA ruled in our favor your government continues to decline to lift the tariffs.
In sum what I'm saying is this: the integration between the West and the Middle-East must not only continue but accelerate - this in my eyes is the only antidote to the cycle of madness. The Middle-East has to be economically integrated to the World economy .
At the end of the day yes everyone tries to get the best deal ever (which is what business is about anyway) but to repeat my above statement: 'nations that trade don't fight'.
Peace out.
Heh, Hugo nothing was in reference to you. The "Wow!" line was about me. I used your name earlier in my ramblings for goofiness alone. It's simply my own experiences and not in reference to anything anyone else typed.
All I can say is you really must know how different their "capitalistic" approach is. It's like my Pappy used to say, "You've never been insulted until you've done business with an Arab Capitalist."
I've read enough books. Now I go on my own innane gut feeling and experiences.
Off topic a bit, but I learned long ago about how I wanted to write from a superb publisher I once worked along side. His first tip was know your reader. His second tip was write like you've known your reader for years. That's why I normally don't quote books or use ten cent words as I used to do. Most haven't read the books and don't care to do so, and ten cent words in an informal setting or medium make you look arrogant.
Again, not about anyone. Just a simple explanation as to why I can come off as abrasive. So now you know I know you and that my perceived idiosyncratic and caustic diatribes are just my way of saying, "Hi pal." That, and I just like to make KKB feel that he is an erudite think tank of a man on a global scale. XD
Like a midget at a urinal, I was going to have to be on my toes.
Invite a retard to a picnic and you'd better expect to get drool in the potato salad.
Last edited: Tuesday, February 21, 2006 at 7:12:01 PM
I've been in retail for 12 years, and my relationship with customers have not been corporate, but mostly with individuals on holidays or on business travels, so I have a limited experience, but then we all do.
@ Hugo
Were you the guy in Toronto selling the cheap watered down beer on the street last year? If so, just thought you'd like to know - it gave me the runs.
One last thing - I thought you looked more like a harvey wallbanger than a cosmopolitan......
I've been following this story as closely as its promoted during the 5 minute, top-of-the-hour blurbs on the radio. At first I thought it was kinda silly to let the UAE do this sort of thing, but during the 11 o'clock recap something hit me.
Seems all rather racist to me.
I mean, are we saying that all Arabs are terrorists and not to be trusted? That giving the UAE this contract with weaken our homeland security just because they're probably Muslims? It would seem that the company in question has had to go through some sort of qualifying evaluation in order to even be considered for the contract, let alone have it awarded to them.
It just kinda funny to me to observe the reaction to the news in that frame of mind. We're all inclusive and accepting until it seems it might impact us personally, then sterotypes and fears come right back at cha!
So, where's the Coast guard then? Doesn't the port authority just load and unload ships? What am I missing here?
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5226999
Were you the guy in Toronto selling the cheap watered down beer on the street last year
The guy with the moustache and the wig? Nah, that was my twin brother. %)
I don't think the US is being racist at all. How many Mosques were burned after 911? How many beheadings of Middle Eastern folk in NY took place? I think we've pretty much looked out for those folks here in the States. Looks at what's going on over some cartoons.
The difference is simple. When the Towers fell we all wanted to get the "terrorists" only. When goofy cartoons are published it's down with all of America and Israel. It's a completely different way of thinking and the Middle Eastern propaganda machine is light years beyond anything in the West.
Here's what I'd tell the UAE. Good offer guys but if you haven't noticed we've got some silly little terrorist activity being carried out by some of your boys. Take care of that over the next decade or so, then come back and we'll hook you with a nice new port. To be honest guys we don't know who exactly your boys are and who we can actually trust right now, nothing personal.
Would it be easier for a terrorist org to bribe a UAE controlled port or a British controlled port? I can see it now, "Hey Mr. Port owner, it's Mr. Terrorist. Let us smuggle some of this in to the States or we'll wipe your lineage from the map." I personally am not interested in seeing that happen.
There's a great documentary being aired on Discovery Times. It's called "Off To War." Check this out if you can.
I think this is an issue of keeping your guard up to avoid the right cross.
I still won't do business with them. Heh. That's a personal feeling of course.
Like a midget at a urinal, I was going to have to be on my toes.
Invite a retard to a picnic and you'd better expect to get drool in the potato salad.
Last edited: Wednesday, February 22, 2006 at 9:38:54 AM
How many Mosques were burned after 911? How many beheadings of Middle Eastern folk in NY took place
This tolerance is indeed a sign of an advance civilization.
Your right hugo...
We only torture and kill in THEIR countries.. Not in our own
out of sight out of mind... We must be an advanced civilisation.
"the rich are free while the poor are put in cages"
You think if the middle east had the capabilities of the armies of america and britain they would have "liberated" US by now for the vast amounts of terrorist acts which we carry out in their countries. WE are not the victim
Last edited: Friday, February 24, 2006 at 1:04:46 AM
@ Rogue - I think you missed my point. We seem to be generally saying as a nation that we can't trust Arabs. Sure, some of the terrorists we are dealing with are Arabic, but some aren't. And unless there's a solid reason for rejecting the contract based on the company's performance, then I think we're rejecting it for the wrong reasons.
But I don't know, is it easier to bribe an Arab than an Englishman?
Nah, I got your point. And I see why it could be conceived that way. If it was Jordan or Turkey buying these ports would we be having this conversation? Well, Turkey's more Meditteranean so bad example there. Off topic, I love Turkish folk. My two best friends, a married couple, here in DC are Turks. If you ever get the chance eat at a Turkish restaurant.
The company in question is government owned by the UAE.
To your last question. Yes in my opinion. See the down with America and Israel parades for one example. Somebody else posted links to other suspect goings on by the UAE so no need for me to regurgitate.
Like a midget at a urinal, I was going to have to be on my toes.
Invite a retard to a picnic and you'd better expect to get drool in the potato salad.
Last edited: Friday, February 24, 2006 at 6:58:36 AM
http://www.crooksandliars.com/2006/02/23.html#a7273
http://www.crooksandliars.com/2006/02/23.html#a7266
Damn, go lou.
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Port security may be handed over to the UAE ( United Arab Emerates). Both parties seem to disagree with the White Houses deciscion to make this happen. The UAE has funded Al Quaida and other terroist groups, and supposedly had a hand in 9-11. I cannot believe this! Believe it or not the mafia ran the ports during WW2 and did an excellent job keeping the Nazis in check, althought the government looked the other way regarding thier criminal activities. Any thoughts?
Last edited: Monday, February 20, 2006 at 7:31:22 PM