We see it everywhere. Fot the faithful, its downright disturbing. This girl named Kaylee I went to homecoming with last year has decided that shes "bored with boys." She says that guys are donkey-holes (not actual employment of word usage) and that she has deceided that girls are nicer. And about a week ago while I was busy expressing my testosterone by puttng matching flaming eight ball seat and steering wheel covers on my mercedes, I saw a neighbor of mine by the name of brandon run by in bright red high-heeled shoes (my girlfriend refereed to them as "pumps"), fishnet, a roxy shirt, and a rather large louis vuitton purse. I dont know how many more people I can stand to see "expressing themselves." Is it society? Or estrogen? I think both.

Ok, so according to you, we're all meant to be gay. So how are people born exactly, if we're all supposed to be gay?

Maybe we got curious? %)

Possibly or non sexual. In God's garden there was no need for "reproduction". Take out of the Bible what you will, it seeminly contradicts itself many times. However, if you read between the lines and understand the time and concepts in which it was originally told you will see the message(trust me I have a long way to go down this road). I could not ever see Jesus Christ turn his back on any form of love.

There is no "meant." It's a natural genetic condition like lefthandedness. "nature" has no consciousness and no intent--it's just there.

Let's apply your logic to another condition: height.

Point A: If there had meant to be short people, then why aren't fruit trees much shorter so short people could reach them?
Point B: If there had meant to be short people, then why do only tall people end up being able to pick fruit off trees, touch exit signs, etc.?

You see how absurd this is? Again, there is no "meant." There is no "right" or "wrong" with genes or hormones unless they harm in themselves without any outside influence.

@Monica

I think you should also open up yourself and start being aware of the fact that we don't know much about anything. It is hard to deny that the reason sexuality is there is for the purpose of reproduction. It is a fact and the intent is clear. Now, nature made sure we would practice this thing by making it pleasurable - nature operating in a non communist way it doesn't coerce but entices - Once the sexual desire is there, people will exploit it any whichway they can derive satisfaction. Sometimes it expresses itself in strange ways, but this is the unavoidable interaction of a human desire with different human psychologies.

It is not true that things happen only randomly and with no intent. Call it God or whachumacallit, there is an evolutionary process that seem universal. Like the theory of evolution there are two basic principles at play constantly, a force leading things toward complexity and a natural selection. I know it's easier to live a life filled with certainties, but it is also exactly what religious fanatics are doing. Not a nice bunch to ne associated with.

Hurk. "Nature" doesn't have a will. Originally, sexuality helped generations to reproduce and pass on their genes. Are we not allowed to take advantage of that? Are we not allowed to love people the way we want?

Hurk again. "nature" isn't a being. It doesn't have "intent." Evolution is the non-random adaptation and survival of random genetic mutations, and we have outsmarted the rest of the universe in that we can control our environment. I resent the use of the word "communist" in that sentence as well.

There is no "force" in evolution. It's simply that mutations that help a generation to survive and thus reproduce (the only biological "purpose" of a living thing) and pass along its genes.

That's the point. We control who we are, what we evolve into. Not some conscious "force" or "spirit."

In my opinion this thread is totally inappropriate, and should be locked down.

I'm done here, apparently some people can't see enough to know it's wrong, so no point in me wasting any more words.

EDIT: Last remarks: For those here who aren't gay (almost all I believe). Does it ever bother you when you see two gay people showing PDA? If so, how can you still believe it to be right, when your heart is telling you right there that it's wrong?

Last edited: Sunday, September 10, 2006 at 10:00:50 AM

@Monica

You confirm my hypothesis that hard core materialism is the mirror image of blind belief. You can't even get passed the words to get to the idea. Please make an effort.
...

I don't know why you're saying that - I never said anything to the contrary

Resenting is not an argument

You're only pushing the question further back. You can't escape the fact that a bunch of rocks have evolved into a human being capable of composing the Mozart requiem (Now trying to convince the atheist I'm giving ammunition to the blind believer, sigh...)- The universe generates complexity, whether you like it or not. Is there "intent" involved? You are free to think not, but in reality, like all of us, you don't really know for sure.

You lost me, I don't see the connection with my quote.

Last edited: Sunday, September 10, 2006 at 10:57:09 AM

It was an unrelated statement.

Right--we all don't know for sure in the same way we don't know for sure whether there is a microscopic teapot orbiting Mars.

I never tried to.

About as much as hetero people doing the same thing.

Because it doesn't harm anyone

I thought my brain was the one "telling [me]" things, and my heart was just a muscle that pumped blood...

Last edited: Sunday, September 10, 2006 at 11:44:00 AM

@ fuji

You know how I know you're gay?

Because you like italic f's.

ƒ is the musical notation forte, meaning loud. If you met me you would know I could never be light in my loafers. ;)

THE ULTIMATE GAY TEST RIGHT HERE

Loudly pronounce that your "privates" are showing. All girls who look are straight. All guys who look are gay. All girl who don't look are lesbian. All guys that don't look are missing out.

Actually I thought the ultimate test was to see whether one could beat box...

All I can say is that I think homosexuality is nasty

Why should someone be discriminated because they like the same gender. I mean, gay men may act more feminine than regular men, but who's to say that's a bad thing? Gay women are the same way, but different example.

I just let them be, and go on with life.

Could you please make that more of a sweeping generalization for us?

^Shall I put on my bra again? Here kitty kitty. Here kitty kitty.

............I just dont get it, I know Homosexuality isn't what were used to, but its what others feel is right, jsut leave homos and bis alone, and jsut like them for who they are, not for who the have affection for (unless its you, then ur screwed, bub) We cant do anything about Stopping Homosexuality, its all in there minds and hearts, how would u feel if u were Homo or Bi huh? Huh? Any takers on how it feels? Well....to tell u the whole truth, I sorta do, but lets not go into that. Just live the life that you want, and let others live nad let live, in France they said " let them eat cake! " well I say "Let them be Gay!'

-Vig

Are you sure you are a guy? I haven't never met a guy spotting such things. ;)

When I read Fiji's first post, I had a different take on what I thought he meant instead of where this thread invariably lead. It seemed to me that he was saying that homosexuality has somehow become popular or the cool thing to do and that he was frustrated with that movement. Personally, I can see that. I'd say a lot more teens are experimenting with homosexual relationships than would have 20 years ago due to its being out there more and popularized in the media. I'm sure there are truely gay people out there, but I'd say there are a lot of people just experiementing with the lifestyle, but aren't looking for a serious relationship.

The other thing is that saying one doesn't like the behavior or feels uncomfortable around it doesn't equal hatred. And yelling someone into submission or silence doesn't really promote understanding either. In such cases, the "enlightened" one becomes as much a brow-beater as those whom they suppose to correct. If we really believe everyone is free to choose how they think, feel and live, then at holds true for every opinion, not just those that are popular or culturally accepted at this time and place.

One thing that is really striking is how often the Christian faith is so poorly represented and understood when referenced during these discussions. More often than not, the ideas represented are caricatures or at the very least, the "Cliff Notes" of the faith. If we're really going to use it as a source for either side of the discussion, we should at least represent it accurately.

Gay, politics, Religion

Getting evermore less interesting......

Last edited: Monday, September 11, 2006 at 1:05:28 PM

Sexual Rights According the World Health Organization:

1. The right to sexual freedom. Sexual freedom encompasses the possibility for individuals to express their full sexual potential. However, this excludes all forms of sexual coercion, exploitation and abuse at any time and situations in life.

2. The right to sexual autonomy, sexual integrity, and safety of the sexual body. This right involves the ability to make autonomous decisions about one's sexual life within a context of one's own personal and social ethics. It also encompasses control and enjoyment of our own bodies free from torture, mutilation and violence of any sort.

3. The right to sexual privacy. This involves the right for individual decisions and behaviors about intimacy as long as they do not intrude on the sexual rights of others.

4. The right to sexual equity. This refers to freedom from all forms of discrimination regardless of sex, gender, sexual orientation, age, race, social class, religion, or physical and emotional disability.

5. The right to sexual pleasure. Sexual pleasure, including autoeroticism, is a source of physical, psychological, intellectual and spiritual well being.

6. The right to emotional sexual expression. Sexual expression is more than erotic pleasure or sexual acts. Individuals have a right to express their sexuality through communication, touch, emotional expression and love.

7. The right to sexually associate freely. This means the possibility to marry or not, to divorce, and to establish other types of responsible sexual associations.

8. The right to make free and responsible reproductive choices. This encompasses the right to decide whether or not to have children, the number and spacing of children, and the right to full access to the means of fertility regulation.

9. The right to sexual information based upon scientific inquiry. This right implies that sexual information should be generated through the process of unencumbered and yet scientifically ethical inquiry, and disseminated in appropriate ways at all societal levels.

10. The right to comprehensive sexuality education. This is a lifelong process from birth throughout the life cycle and should involve all social institutions.

11. The right to sexual health care. Sexual health care should be available for prevention and treatment of all sexual concerns, problems and disorders.

I completely agree with you, rab. Im glad you understand; very few others did. 44 takes the offensive approach in his thread with his "YOU FAGGOT." he assumes that im a "basher." im not like that. I dont hate gays. The part of this that bothers me is that society has begun to wrap its arms around this concept and is starting to almost broadcast homosexuality as a target audience (e.g. "Will and Grace"). I even see them at my church. Sure, let them do or feel how they want, but dont let this become antoher fad or something. Experimenting is fine, just dont let it disrupt other people's lives.